Ethics, integrity, social consciousness, fairness — it is no surprise that the values Ratan Tata prizes are those dear to the conglomerate he leads. The chairman of the Tata Group isn't one for talking much about himself, but turn the topic away from the personal and the clarity and conviction of his views are apparent.

In this interview with Christabelle Noronha, the 64-year-old chairman talks about matters off the beaten business track: the people who have influenced him, what puts him off, the Tata legacy for future generations, and the difference between the good ol’ days and now.

Tell us something about the people who have shaped your thinking.
One very important person who shaped the way I think is JRD Tata, who I worked with in varying degrees of closeness. There have been others, some of whom I have personally known. I admired John F Kennedy when I was in college; I never met him but his thinking influenced me in many ways.

Then there are men such as Professor Amar Bose*, a person with high ideals and a strong value system. I have known him closely for many years, have shared many things with him and have great regard for him. He has had a profound impact on my thinking. Another name that comes to mind is that of Jean Riboud, the former chairman of Schlumberger**,  with whom I had a close personal relationship.

There’s a common thread these people share — strong values. They have integrity of a high order and a very forceful social consciousness in terms of what their corporations do. In addition, they are warm, thoughtful and caring human beings.

What quality in an individual do you admire most?
It’s the qualities I spoke about in those who have influenced me. Additionally, I admire people who are very successful. But if that success has been achieved through too much ruthlessness, then I may admire that person, but I can’t respect him.

How have you put these qualities into use in business?
Business, as I have seen it, places one great demand on you: it needs you to self-impose a framework of ethics, values, fairness and objectivity on yourself at all times. It is easy not to do this; you cannot impose it on yourself forcibly because it has to become an integral part of you. 

What has to go through your mind at the time of every decision, or most decisions is: does this stand the test of public scrutiny in terms of what I said earlier? As you think the decision through, you have to automatically feel that this is wrong, incorrect, or unfair. You have to think of the advantages or disadvantages to the segments involved, be it employees or stakeholders.

What puts you off?
I often get frustrated by acts or implementations that are incomplete or imperfect, where I feel someone has not thought something through and has just done the job mechanically. This works at different levels. 

You don't expect a clerk to exercise foresight. But if you move up the corporate ladder you expect people, particularly those near the top, to have thought through situations in terms of all implications, to have ascribed the value system I described earlier, and undertaken or implemented what is necessary in totality. I appreciate a person who does a little bit of overkill, even though it is not necessary. I get very, very frustrated and upset if someone does things in a sloppy manner.

What would you like the younger generation to learn from the Tatas?
I don’t know how much they can learn from us, other than the framework of what is right or wrong. The message I would like to leave for future generations is that the Tatas need to undergo tremendous change. We are trying to undertake that change; we need the Tatas to be known as less rigid, less averse to change, and willing to question the unquestioned rather than operate on assumptions. The younger generation should bring that changed mindset into the Tata Group.

Can companies be role models?
A company can be a role model in terms of its system and, of course, the person driving that system is the CEO of the company. The system is, in a manner of speaking, the key to implementation and should be institutionalised.

It gets a bit dangerous when the CEO has no system and his personality drives the organisation, which he runs like his personal fiefdom. In these circumstances it’s actually the CEO who is the role model and not the company.

Which companies do you think can act as role models?
The kind of company one would want to emulate is one where products and technology are at the leading edge, dealings with customers are very fair, services are of a high order, and business ethics are transparent and straightforward. A less tangible issue involves the work environment, which should not be one where you are stressed and driven to the point of being drugged.

One can’t adopt a single role model, as it has to embody all that you want to do. Different companies may be role models for different reasons. Overall, you may consider General Electric a role model for its tremendous growth. GE had a strong CEO who drove and transformed it. But however much you respect a Jack Welch, you may not be able to transform GE into another company.

Are there any companies in the Tata Group that fit the bill?
Tata Steel has many of the attributes of the model company, though not all of them. Tata Motors, too, has some. But it’s very difficult to make a judgement about each company unless you are in it.

Why does the Tata Group not have women in senior positions?
There is no conscious effort not to have women in senior positions. And the Tata Group has had women in senior positions in the past. It’s a valid question, though. Some Indian companies would absolutely not have a woman in a top position, sometimes not even in employment. We don’t have any such issue. In Tata Motors we have several women engineers who work alongside our male engineers. 

One often tends to turn to company policy when it comes to the topic of women in senior positions. Apart from policy, this is an issue of the environment, even at the peer level. If a company has to be conducive to having women in senior posts, there should be peer acceptance. No matter what the company policy is, in India peer acceptance is still a problem. It is something our country has to get over. The solution is to get more women involved.

It must be exciting for a person like yourself, having been with the Tatas for so long, to see the world change and to be involved in making your businesses change? Were the good old days better?
The good old days were the good old days; there was less stress even though the times weren’t as exciting as they are now. Today’s world is more stressful and demanding. The expression ‘good old days’ is quite appropriate since you could be more carefree then. You had more time, more leeway to make mistakes without them being devastating. 

All in all, the demands on you were more related to intrinsic things, to gut feel rather than detailed study. I enjoy being in the age we are. And I do believe we have a tougher job to do today.

What are your most distinguishing characteristics?
It’s very difficult for me to talk about myself. I would like to think I’m fair and just, and that I’m accessible to everyone (there’s no bar on any employee coming to me). And I’d like to believe I’m operating honestly. That is something I am proud of.

* Professor Amar Bose is the founder of Bose Corporation, the world-famous manufacturer of audio equipment

** Schlumberger is a global technology services company with a presence in nearly 100 countries.